Equal Rights for the LGBT Community?

[Mandalore]

I also find the wide spread discrimination and hate they face throughout the "Civilized Christian West" to be deplorable.

u cant make the christans be quite because thats againnst there free speaching right so u need 2 let them do that so respect it

What Mandolore is saying is that it's not ok for any Christian to hate but it's ok for him to hate. Also Mandalore, do you think that the Christians in your civilized European State would approve or are they just as hateful as the Civilized Christian West?

Not sure what you mean. For one, I live in America. Secondly, it'd be pretty hard to deny the fact that the overwhelming majority against homosexuality comes from monotheists (and Hindus from what I've heard). My problem with Christians is that they claim to love their neighbors but continually discriminate against homosexuals. I guess the better term instead of Christians would be conservatives, as liberal Christians tend to be a bit less hardcore.

[burzerker]

Licences of all kinds are not rights and never have been, including marriage. We limit peoples ability to drive due to age or other factors, that's a form of discrimination. Any form of arbitrary line is drawn for all kinds of things, it doesn't make it wrong to limit someones ability to do something. Society has defined marriage as one man and one woman for centuries. I know some cultures or religions have allowed multiple wives, why is that not discrimination. Once we start altering the definaitions we have used we will end up with a huge line of other groups that want the same thing. A few years back I remember there was a story from Israel that some woman married a dolphin, and another story here in the US where some guy had a wedding ceremony with his dog, are these to be next? Homosexual couples already have almost all the same rights as hetros do, just not the piece of paper that we call marriage. What exactly are they losing out on? You can write wills any way you want, medical decisions can be left to whomever you want, I'm pretty sure you can add "partners" to insurance etc.. what exactly is missing? If they want to have some ceremony that they declare themselves to eachother for life fine, nobody is stopping them, we just shouldn't call it marriage.

[Doves]

You cant honestly think that marriage hasn't changed over the years

http://gaymarriage.lifetips.com/cat/643 ... index.html

Humankind has always formed family units in order to survive. Marriage was a way of legally formalising the agreements between families when a woman was passed from the protection of her father to her husband.

This agreement was usually accompanied by financial arrangements, sometimes in the form of a dowry given to the husband for his wife's keep. In return, the wife had no rights to property, children, or refusal to engage in sex with her husband. In areas of England , wives were even sold between men in a crude form of divorce.

New York was the first US state to pass a Married Woman's Property Act, entitling women to the ownership of property, sign contracts, and keep wages they earned. In 1978, New York became the first state to outlaw rape in marriage.

Since the early part of the 20th century, marriage has evolved into a formal recognition of emotional commitment. One of the positive gay marriage facts is that, as ideas of gender and possession are different in a gay marriage, the custom will evolve further away from its tradition of ownership.

The idea of a marriage has changed greatly over the years and its only a er of time before gays are allowed to marry.

[mrjamwin]

Correction on the assumption of you being European. So let me state this first. You make a post about peoples views on whether gays and lesbians should be allowed to marry which in itself is interesting to discuss but then you throw a hate bomb into the discussion about your dislike for Christians. So since you seem to be ok with painting this picture with such a broad paint brush, would you please give us an example and tell us which Christians discriminate against homosexuals and how is it that they discriminate againt them?

[Chin]

assuming all valid religions/philosophies should be based upon some formulation of the golden rule if everyone must do unto others as they would have others do unto them, then that means some kind of tolerance must be practiced, because obviously you wouldn't want someone else to be intolerant or openly discriminate against you, so I think that we can conclude that the west(or as the precocious re: arrogant 17 year old likes to put it "Civilized Christian West") since it is founded upon a formulation of the golden rule (Christianity, Kantian ethics) would allow tolerance towards others, as such, even Christianity would say we should b e tolerant towards LBGT, not that we should encourage this behaviour, but rather that we should practice tolerance, love, etc.
Where do we draw the line though? What counts as "Discrimination" and just normal societal constructs, for instance I can't go to a girls bathroom because I am a guy, is that discriminatory? no. Is there something about marriage that makes it discriminatory to prevent LBGT from marrying? T Why do LBGT want to marry? I suppose it would be about the specific rights that come when they are married (Adoption, etc.), but couldn't we have some alternative to marriage whereby they could obtain the same rights? Is there anything unique about marriage that makes it such a coveted prize for the LBGT community?

I personally am an advocate of tolerance, but maybe an alternative to marriage because I don't see any particular reason why LBGT should marry, unless there is a valid reason, then by marrying they are just arbitrarily breaking social constructs.

[Brazosgrad]

Well then. I'd like to marry my computer. It doesn't get emotional. It doesn't complain when I don't take the trash out. It makes me happy. I can play with it any time I want and I don't get told "I have a headache". It makes a great play companion for the kids. It follows strict rules that I set up for it. It goes to sleep when I make it. It doesn't wet the floor like the dog. It doesn't care if there's another computer in the room with it, or how I look at the other computer. Yep. I'd say this is looking better all the time...

[(SWGO)Kren]

...let's not forget sparta....

[Corpse]

What about marrying a dead body? ^^

[Brazosgrad]

Corpse said...

What about marrying a dead body? ^^

I don't know much about that. You'd have to ask Darth Ripley if its worth it...

[Duel of Fates]

I can see this headline in the near future. MAN MARRIES DOG ---- In order to keep his beloved pet alive with expensive medical treatments, the man marries the dog to get the dog under his medical insurance.

All kidding aside, the States have the right to hand out "marriage" licenses to whomever they want. NOT the Federal Government.