The God Damned Gun Control Thread

[mrjamwin]

I know logic and facts went out the window in this thread awhile ago but none the less my final thoughts. We do have gun control measures here in the U.S. and they work well enough for the lawful American citizen. Could some of them be strengthened? Yes. Do they take into account presently those Americans that appear normal but have mental conditions? No. I'm sure they could be strengthened and could possibly start addressing mental issues. But the real issue at hand is not gun control but the very fact that our rights given by our Constituition is being threatened at being taken away. And the moment the government begins to take one right away then it opens the door to the government being allowed to seize all of our rights. If you believe that this can not happen then you are delusional. I've seen people ask why we need AR-15's or AK-47 and high capacity magazine etc. The majority of the people who own these types of guns use them for sport and they're just plain fun to shoot. Can they be used for home defense? Yes they can. I don't think that the majority of the people buying these types of guns are having visions of granduer of one day over throwing the government. But with that said, our Constituition does grant us the right to protect us from that very threat. The reality is the majority of the murders committed with the use of guns are done by people who have no intent of obeying the law and would obtain guns anyway they can and if they're that bent of breaking laws and could not obtain a gun then they're going to use any means at hand that they can. I've witnessed first hand the 2 massacares that have occurred here in Colorado being that I lived here and both times I have known people that I've been close to who where there in the midst of the violence. The Columbine incident those boys obtained their guns illegally and even built bombs that they were going set off and the Aurora movie theater incident which is 10 mintues from my house Holmes obtained his weapons legally. Whether there is gun control or not there is no way to predict or prevent what criminal acts can occur. Can we say that we need to get more guns off the street? Yes, but how are they getting there in the first place? It is a well known fact that our dumb ass government in a screwed up plan called Fast and Furious let guns intentionally get into the hands of people who were going to commit a crime. So now these guns are out being used against innocent people and we know for a fact that one of these guns was used to kill a U.S. Border guard to which the government to this day will not take responsibility for and barely acknowledges. Anyway I'm starting to digress here, but my point original point again that I wanted to make is that once you let the governement take one right then the door is wide open to take the rest and that's what we're fighting against.

[Duel of Fates]

[(SWGO)Minas_Thirith]

Allright duel, time to end this

Spoiler: show

And do check this link:
It basically answers many of examples stated in this thread, from self-protecion to people killing people, not the guns
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/01/pro-gun-myths-fact-check

MT

[mrjamwin]

Again MT you miss the point. Were all those deaths by people who were legal gun owners or by ones with criminal intent to begin with. You see you want to punish the wrong group of people. Legal gun owners aren't the ones out there committing the crimes. You're biased motherjones website shows lots of "facts" again proving that those committing the murders are not by legal responsible gun owners.

[NiteRunner81]

MT, where do you live? NOT IN AMERICA right? Maybe you should take the energy you are focusing in this thread and do something to make your own home country better. I'm not trying to insult you but you're wasting your time arguing for something thats not really affecting your community.. The energy is better spent.

I back Jammy's statements to the letter. Gun issues hit close to home to me with the Clackamas mall shooting and with something even more personal.... I'm going to place before you exhibit A on why we need to educate our youth on gun safety EARLY.... Hubby, myself, and Simon will be taking a hunters safety course when our tank hits 11.

Exhibit A:

Spoiler: show

Tillamook seventh graders (name removed) and (name Removed) received Police Department Citizens Awards at the Tillamook City Council meeting for doing the right thing when they found a loaded handgun in the Coliseum Theater during a class trip in December. The boys demonstrated smart thinking, good judgment and an awareness of gun safety when they spotted the gun and treated it as if it was loaded, which it was. The boys alerted an adult and averted a situation that could have been tragic.
“You two are heroes,” Mayor Weber told the boys. “I thank you for being there. The actions you took ensured your safety and that of your classmates and teachers. We are exceptionally proud of your decision and how you responded.”
Police Chief Terry Wright and Tillamook 911 administrator Doug Kettner presented the award with the mayor, thanking (name removed) and (name removed) and shaking their hands.
The boys received plaques of appreciation and $100 gift cards to Fred Meyer. They also received free movie passes for a year from the Coliseum Theater.

If you're wondering what happened in Tillamook here is a link to the story. Names removed for privacy reasons. I went to school with one of the boy's mom.

http://www.katu.com/news/local/Student-finds-loaded-gun-on-floor-of-Tillamook-movie-theater--184161421.html

http://www.katu.com/news/local/Man-who-left-gun-under-seat-has-permit-revoked-184355211.html

Now you may be scratching your head over why I'm showing a LEGAL gun owner who did very wrong and using it in this arguement? Well, that legal gun owner has had his CCW REVOKED and his gun shop is being investigated. He did wrong and the current gun control measures are rectifying the situation... I don't think we need any more gun laws, we need mental health care.... and with that it means that their names are put in a database that cross checks with gun applications.. simple, effective.. DONE!!!

[MATTHEW'S_DAD]

We're not suggesting regulating or illegalising every item that could possibly be involved in mass murder, but, seeing as the majority of these crimes occur with the help of automatic weapons,

And this is where I stopped reading your post.

I'll say this loudly. THERE ARE NO AUTOMATIC WEAPONS THAT ARE LEGALLY FOR SALE IN THE UNITED STATES TO THE PUBLIC. AUTOMATIC WEAPONS HAVE BEEN BANNED IN THE US SINCE THE NATIONAL FIREARMS ACT IN 1934

[MATTHEW'S_DAD]

Allright duel, time to end this

Spoiler: show

And do check this link:
It basically answers many of examples stated in this thread, from self-protecion to people killing people, not the guns
http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2013/01/pro-gun-myths-fact-check

MT

LMFAO at that left wing trash site. Let's just get it out in the open and say what's on our minds. Everyone who want to see the American Constitution amended so that the 2nd amendment is repealed, say "aye". For those that say "aye", then do it, quit wasting time and do it. Otherwise, no more damn laws. It's a waste of time and money and is a fool's endeavor.

That Mother Jones link only goes to show that you can spew anything on the internet and skew statistics in any direction and there will be people who will read it and believe it.

[Duel of Fates]

And now I listen for the giant Woooosh sound, as that one flies right over their heads.

[(SWGO)SirPepsi]

And this is where I stopped reading your post.

I'll say this loudly. THERE ARE NO AUTOMATIC WEAPONS THAT ARE LEGALLY FOR SALE IN THE UNITED STATES TO THE PUBLIC. AUTOMATIC WEAPONS HAVE BEEN BANNED IN THE US SINCE THE NATIONAL FIREARMS ACT IN 1934

I'm sorry I should have made myself clear:

We're not suggesting regulating or illegalising every item that could possibly be involved in mass murder, but, seeing as the majority of these crimes occur with the help of firearms, we think it would be wise to have a discussion on how to preserve civilian lives, maybe using gun regulation, stricter background checks, and mandatory classes for the aforementioned purpose.

Many of you like to conjure up photos illustrating catchy slogans that you think constitute valid arguments. They don't. Screaming incessantly that they do because you don't know what the word "evidence" means does not exempt you from having to provide it.

Here is some evidence, written as early as a month ago that defines a not-so-difficult to identify loophole in the law: http://blogs.lawyers.com/2013/01/no-bac ... -gun-show/.

[Outrider]

But the real issue at hand is not gun control but the very fact that our rights given by our Constituition is being threatened at being taken away.

The issue is gun control. One potential control measure as we all know is that a certain category of guns could be added to the list of arms in which civilians currently already cannot have easy access. So how exactly is this infringing on the second amendment? You still have the right to keep and bear arms, just not those particular arms.

And the moment the government begins to take one right away then it opens the door to the government being allowed to seize all of our rights. If you believe that this can not happen then you are delusional.

This has already happened with the Patriot Act, so the door has been opened for quite a while now. How much longer do you think until all of our rights will be taken away in a manner that isn't so obvious? Yeah, because when the government starts taking our guns away that's the first sign of trouble that all of our rights will go down the hole.

I've seen people ask why we need AR-15's or AK-47 and high capacity magazine etc. The majority of the people who own these types of guns use them for sport and they're just plain fun to shoot. Can they be used for home defense? Yes they can. I don't think that the majority of the people buying these types of guns are having visions of granduer of one day over throwing the government. But with that said, our Constituition does grant us the right to protect us from that very threat.

So those people will have fun for now, and when the government gets nasty, they will keep it in check with those guns? One of the top reasons gun control opponents (in this thread included) give for owning those types of guns is to use them to counter the possible threat of a tyrannical government from ever arising. So are they just using the Founding Fathers' reasons for having the second amendment in the first place as a stand-in to hold onto these guns for their actual intention, that is for entertainment purposes? That's a little hard to believe. Now, if the Founding Father's reasons are indeed their actual intention for keeping restriction-free/legal access to these guns, then they are going at it wrong. They should be more focused on getting restriction lifts on warheads, armored vehicles, and other arms of that nature. Otherwise, they'll be heavily outgunned when the government indeed does get nasty. Speaking of which, how much more out of hand does the government need to become before the use of these guns is necessary? We already lost our right to privacy. Is "taking our guns away" the last straw?

I'll say this loudly. THERE ARE NO AUTOMATIC WEAPONS THAT ARE LEGALLY FOR SALE IN THE UNITED STATES TO THE PUBLIC. AUTOMATIC WEAPONS HAVE BEEN BANNED IN THE US SINCE THE NATIONAL FIREARMS ACT IN 1934

Which version of the National Firearms Act did you read? :S