Obamacare

[Duel of Fates]

Back on topic, I tried to log in again first thing this morning (6:30 EST) and the website is still down. This is the end of the 3rd week. Anyone have any positive experiences yet?

Cue the crickets.

[[NH]Shadow]

Back on topic, I tried to log in again first thing this morning (6:30 EST) and the website is still down. This is the end of the 3rd week. Anyone have any positive experiences yet?

Cue the crickets.

*chirp chirp*
*chirp*

[(SWGO)SirPepsi]

Obamacare = not a good idea. All I'm gonna say...MD's stats pretty much summed it all up though.

Oh, it's an absolutely wonderful idea! It just hasn't been refined well enough yet, and this is more an intrinsic flaw within our legislative process than the Bill itself, but, to be sure, there are kinks to work out.

[MATTHEW'S_DAD]

uhhhh, OK.

[[NH]Shadow]

Obamacare = not a good idea. All I'm gonna say...MD's stats pretty much summed it all up though.

Oh, it's an absolutely wonderful idea! It just hasn't been refined well enough yet, and this is more an intrinsic flaw within our legislative process than the Bill itself, but, to be sure, there are kinks to work out.

But...but...but.....but....MD, and im sure a lot of other people, are spending an additional 800$/month...

[(SWGO)SirPepsi]

Exactly, the system in place is far from perfect, and the Affordable Care Act may be difficult to adapt to - but the idea of living in a nation in which all citizens have access to quality healthcare, regardless of wealth or extraneous factors is beautiful. Take, for example, a sick child who is born into a Middle Class family that chose not to purchase health care and doesn't qualify for Medicaid, and who, subsequently, cannot afford to pay consultation rates - much less actual treatment costs... or a widow, estranged from her family, who had, in the common patriotic string of virus characteristic to those of a certain mentality, believed health insurance to be frivolous, suddenly falls ill - with no one to support her...she dies. Is that the country we want to live in? Of course not. And though professionals, even without Obamacare, will treat patients unable to pay if the case is declared emergent (and the standards for definition of this particular state are confined to a limited few), they will not treat those who cannot, say, pay for a bone- marrow transplant to offset cancer or dialysis to treat kidney issues.

[CommanderOtto]

well, now it is official that obamacare fails (at least in the exchanges and in health insurance prices)... we still need to see how it affects other things.

anyway, even if it fails completely, obama was the only one who at least tried to do something about the healthcare issue. I'm telling you, for what a person pays as deductible here, that person could stay in a hospital-resort in some beach paradise for the same price. Healthcare in the U.S is very advanced, but it is very inefficient in terms of costs. Of course, healthcare in the U.S has to be expensive since there is no cheap labor, but if it were compared to other first world countries, the benefits obtained versus the amount paid is just unacceptable. Here's a nice image I found, that might help to shed some light here...

[MATTHEW'S_DAD]

Exactly, the system in place is far from perfect, and the Affordable Care Act may be difficult to adapt to - but the idea of living in a nation in which all citizens have access to quality healthcare, regardless of wealth or extraneous factors is beautiful.

Yeah, it's beautiful, but how do we pay for it? An Aston Martin in my driveway would be beautiful too.

[Bryant]

well, now it is official that obamacare fails (at least in the exchanges and in health insurance prices)... we still need to see how it affects other things.

anyway, even if it fails completely, obama was the only one who at least tried to do something about the healthcare issue. I'm telling you, for what a person pays as deductible here, that person could stay in a hospital-resort in some beach paradise for the same price. Healthcare in the U.S is very advanced, but it is very inefficient in terms of costs. Of course, healthcare in the U.S has to be expensive since there is no cheap labor, but if it were compared to other first world countries, the benefits obtained versus the amount paid is just unacceptable. Here's a nice image I found, that might help to shed some light here...

There are still benefits to be obtained within the free market though.
Here's an article about a hospital taking a competitive approach. They posted there surgery cost online, about 1/6th to 1/8th the average cost. So much lower that you could easily afford to take a plane trip there and back.
http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/07/12/free-market-at-work-okla-city-hospital-causes-bidding-war-by-posting-surgery-prices-online/
We also need to open up competitive insurance rates by allowing them to work across state boundaries. But that's been blocked countless times.

This is some of the other problems with government run things:
"Private companies can’t get away with a fraction of what the federal government does, Beck said, because the free market or the government itself will shut them down. But if the federal government is running the show, Beck said, “there is no accountability” and no recourse for the individual."

In the NHS at one hospital from 2005 - 2009, there were 1200 unnecessary deaths. Some from starvation or dehydration and left in complete squalor (this is the case where people were drinking the water out of flowerpots they were so desperate).

Here's what happens when a report talks bad about Obamacare http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/10/23/liberal-tv-host-says-white-house-called-and-bludgeoned-him-after-he-criticized-obamacare/.

Misleading prices: http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/10/23/scathing-cbs-report-obamacare-improvements-leading-to-incredibly-misleading-price-quotes/

The great efficiency of government: http://www.theblaze.com/blog/2013/10/21/firm-behind-botched-obamacare-site-still-has-8-billion-in-govt-contracts/
http://www.theblaze.com/blog/2013/10/14/obamacare-website-was-a-no-bid-government-contract/

Apparently doing your job is propaganda: http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/10/02/dem-congressman-on-10k-pages-of-obamacare-regulations-is-it-important-that-i-read-it/

The real problem: http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/10/02/watch-people-actually-answer-whats-better-obamacare-or-the-affordable-care-act-with-hilarious-results/

Complete loss of privacy: http://www.theblaze.com/stories/2013/10/14/hidden-message-on-obamacare-website-reportedly-warns-users-no-reasonable-expectation-to-privacy/

Do you really want this "business" to run our healthcare?

[(SWGO)SirPepsi]

[/img]

Despite the tremendous lead the United States has in terms of GNP and GDP (note - not P/Capi.), the entrenched medical culture - one in which private practice is championed in culmination with the belief in the frivolity of Healthcare on top of the lack of standardization across states makes our system open to quite a bit of potential waste and ineffectiveness.