Evolution & Creationism Debate at Museum

[CommanderOtto]

As I said before, a day can mean anything. In the universe, a day depends on a point of reference. If you are in earth, it takes 24 hours. If you are in another planet, one day could take much more than that. In fact, Andromeda galaxy (which is "close" to us) is about 2.5 million light years from here. In other words, it takes 2.5 million years for light from that galaxy to get here. No radiometric dating or other human made tests... that's the pure physics of light, and that's what it takes to get to earth (meaning all of creation couldn't have been done in a few days).

[Bobmarine]

As I said before, a day can mean anything. In the universe, a day depends on a point of reference. If you are in earth, it takes 24 hours. If you are in another planet, one day could take much more than that. In fact, Andromeda galaxy (which is "close" to us) is about 2.5 million light years from here. In other words, it takes 2.5 million years for light from that galaxy to get here. No radiometric dating or other human made tests... that's the pure physics of light, and that's what it takes to get to earth (meaning all of creation couldn't have been done in a few days).

My answer to that is that God, since He is all-powerful, could make the light get to Earth immediately after he made the sun, moon, and stars, and it had to be six literal days because the Bible said that He made the plants before He made the Sun, moon, and stars, so let me pose this question, if the "days" were "periods of time" then how did the plants survive without photosynthesis? If it was a day before then yeah, but if it was periods of time, then all the plants would have died.

[Col. Hstar]

My answer to that is that God, since He is all-powerful, could make the light get to Earth immediately after he made the sun, moon, and stars, and it had to be six literal days because the Bible said that He made the plants before He made the Sun, moon, and stars, so let me pose this question, if the "days" were "periods of time" then how did the plants survive without photosynthesis? If it was a day before then yeah, but if it was periods of time, then all the plants would have died.

I would re-read the account in Genesis again. Vs 3-5 is when Light (day and night) were created. It is not until vs 9-12 that vegetation is created.

[(SWGO)DesertEagle]

My answer to that is that God, since He is all-powerful, could make the light get to Earth immediately after he made the sun, moon, and stars, and it had to be six literal days because the Bible said that He made the plants before He made the Sun, moon, and stars, so let me pose this question, if the "days" were "periods of time" then how did the plants survive without photosynthesis? If it was a day before then yeah, but if it was periods of time, then all the plants would have died.

I would re-read the account in Genesis again. Vs 3-5 is when Light (day and night) were created. It is not until vs 9-12 that vegetation is created.

There was light before the sun, moon, and stars. The implication is that it was the Glory of God, but it is not specifically stated. Light was the first thing created.

I know many people are okay with long ages in the Genesis record, but I just a) see no need for it, and b) see no room to put the ages. The text is not as flexible as most people think. Most importantly, you have to look at how the original audience would have interpreted it, and it is overwelmingly in favor of a literal 6 day period.

I see no need to compromise with evolution/long ages/big bang theory. If you are going to accept the Word of God, might as well accept the whole thing.

[Col. Hstar]

I know many people are okay with long ages in the Genesis record, but I just a) see no need for it, and b) see no room to put the ages. The text is not as flexible as most people think. Most importantly, you have to look at how the original audience would have interpreted it, and it is overwelmingly in favor of a literal 6 day period.

I see no need to compromise with evolution/long ages/big bang theory. If you are going to accept the Word of God, might as well accept the whole thing.

Believing that the Genesis account took place over a longer period of time is not a compromise with the theory of evolution. To believe that God created the earth over a period of time instead of within a couple of days does not diminish in anyway the miracle of creation.

But to say it just happened in 6 days when physical evidence we can see today exists makes the creation account seem unbelievable. This is why unfortunately many write of the account as scientifically impossible.
Take this for example:
Light from the Andromeda nebula can be seen on a clear night in the northern hemisphere. It takes about 2,000,000 years for that light to reach the earth, indicating that the universe must be at least millions of years old. Not the 6,000 - 10,000 years that 6 creative days would account for.

The Hebrew word translated “day” has a variety of meanings, including ‘a long time; the time covering an extraordinary event.’ (Old Testament Word Studies, Grand Rapids, Mich.; 1978, W. Wilson, p. 109)

You also still did not explain why you take the term "day" literally in Genesis chapter 1 and as a broad description of time in chapter 2. (Maybe I missed your explanation)

[Mandalore]

This kind of thing is what happens when the purported lord of all creation gives incredibly vague explanations to a phenomenon that would eventually become explicitly explained through math and science. It's almost like it was made by a bunch of scientifically illiterate bronze age Jews...but that couldn't be. Really too bad that this Jehovah guy couldn't just make things easy on himself and given an extremely complex mathematical formula that would be solved centuries later giving any level of credibility to his claims. But no.

[Col. Hstar]

This kind of thing is what happens when the purported lord of all creation gives incredibly vague explanations to a phenomenon that would eventually become explicitly explained through math and science. It's almost like it was made by a bunch of scientifically illiterate bronze age Jews...but that couldn't be. Really too bad that this Jehovah guy couldn't just make things easy on himself and given an extremely complex mathematical formula that would be solved centuries later giving any level of credibility to his claims. But no.

Luke 10:21

[Bobmarine]

My answer to that is that God, since He is all-powerful, could make the light get to Earth immediately after he made the sun, moon, and stars, and it had to be six literal days because the Bible said that He made the plants before He made the Sun, moon, and stars, so let me pose this question, if the "days" were "periods of time" then how did the plants survive without photosynthesis? If it was a day before then yeah, but if it was periods of time, then all the plants would have died.

I would re-read the account in Genesis again. Vs 3-5 is when Light (day and night) were created. It is not until vs 9-12 that vegetation is created.

There was light before the sun, moon, and stars. The implication is that it was the Glory of God, but it is not specifically stated. Light was the first thing created.

I know many people are okay with long ages in the Genesis record, but I just a) see no need for it, and b) see no room to put the ages. The text is not as flexible as most people think. Most importantly, you have to look at how the original audience would have interpreted it, and it is overwelmingly in favor of a literal 6 day period.

I see no need to compromise with evolution/long ages/big bang theory. If you are going to accept the Word of God, might as well accept the whole thing.

What I meant was the light from the stars. Not the light that was there at the beginning.

[(SWGO)DesertEagle]

This kind of thing is what happens when the purported lord of all creation gives incredibly vague explanations to a phenomenon that would eventually become explicitly explained through math and science. It's almost like it was made by a bunch of scientifically illiterate bronze age Jews...but that couldn't be. Really too bad that this Jehovah guy couldn't just make things easy on himself and given an extremely complex mathematical formula that would be solved centuries later giving any level of credibility to his claims. But no.

Luke 10:21

Well put .

[Col. Hstar]

My answer to that is that God, since He is all-powerful, could make the light get to Earth immediately after he made the sun, moon, and stars, and it had to be six literal days because the Bible said that He made the plants before He made the Sun, moon, and stars, so let me pose this question, if the "days" were "periods of time" then how did the plants survive without photosynthesis? If it was a day before then yeah, but if it was periods of time, then all the plants would have died.

What I meant was the light from the stars. Not the light that was there at the beginning.

I guess I'm still confused then by what you're asking. Your supposition is that the periods could not have been longer because there was no light for the plants and vegetation to live off of because there was no light but according to the account light had already been created. This light all comes from the stars, which is a category our sun falls under. That light was still able to penetrate the atmosphere allowing some vegetation to begin to grow.

Remember the creation account begins on vs 3 AFTER the earth and universe had been created. In the beginning the earth was desolate and dark and from that point on the creation account explains how it was formed over periods of time.

Maybe this will help:

THE BEGINNING
The material heavens and earth are created.—Genesis 1:1.

DARKNESS

The earth is formless, desolate, and dark.—Genesis 1:2.

FIRST DAY

Diffused light evidently penetrates the earth’s atmosphere. If there had been any observer on the surface of the earth, the sources of light would have been imperceptible to him. Yet, the difference between night and day became discernible.—Genesis 1:3-5.

SECOND DAY

The earth is covered with water and a dense mantle of vapor. These two elements are separated, creating a gap between the watery surface and the canopy of vapor. The Bible describes this space as “an expanse between the waters,” and calls it “Heaven.”—Genesis 1:6-8.

THIRD DAY

Surface water subsides and dry ground appears. The atmosphere clears up to allow more sunlight to reach the ground. Some vegetation appears, with new species sprouting through the third and subsequent creative days.—Genesis 1:9-13.

FOURTH DAY

The sun and moon become discernible from the earth’s surface.—Genesis 1:14-19.

FIFTH DAY

God creates underwater creatures and flying creatures in great numbers with the ability to procreate within their kinds.—Genesis 1:20-23.

SIXTH DAY

Land animals are created, both large and small. The sixth day culminates with a masterpiece of God’s physical creation: the first human couple.—Genesis 1:24-31.